Speaker 1: 0:00

Hey everyone. This is Chris. I'm Ryan From the Uncommon Path podcast. The scripture, revelation 12 11 says and they have conquered him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony.

Speaker 2: 0:11

Our hope is that as you listen, you will be encouraged in the Lord. This podcast was created as an avenue to share people's raw and unfiltered journeys with him. We hope this brings breakthrough and intimacy with Jesus through their testimony of what God is doing through their lives. We are here today with Michael Pierce, who is, I love talking to other electricians. Michael's also an electrician a fellow blue collar guy like myself. Chris, you wouldn't know anything about that.

Speaker 1: 0:56

Yeah, I slay hardwood floors Ryan Did that for like three weeks okay.

Speaker 2: 1:08

Michael, thanks so much for coming. I really appreciate it. We want to know kind of where your story started with the Lord. What age and what season of life were you in when the reality of relationship with God and Jesus actually means something to you more than just authoritative figure up in the sky?

Speaker 3: 1:37

yeah. So thanks guys for having me, yeah, raised in church like some of the others. Church now Wow, dad was a deacon, granddad was a preacher, two uncles that were a preacher, cousin that was a preacher. Wow, all these little small country churches, 10, 20 people in them, people that were just really, really lovers of God, although maybe not, if you do so, growing up, in that you kind of always knew about God.

Speaker 3: 2:26

But the relationship part you're referring to, I don't think I really understood how powerful the connection to the Lord was. Until I was about 21 years old. I always prayed since the presence of the Lord, but not in the way that I understood. So the only way I can explain how I really got an understanding of God was when I was around 21, hanging out with guys and drinking beer and just doing God things shooting pool and drinking beer, and just doing God things shooting pool and cutting off and working. I come home and I'm like I just had a burning desire out of nowhere to read the Bible and I would read Genesis, start in Genesis. I'm like, okay, you know, I'm going to read it from the front to the back.

Speaker 1: 3:30

It's a pretty good way to do it, being in church most of my life.

Speaker 3: 3:34

I didn't understand the Bible. So so I started reading it and I fell asleep reading it, never even got very far in it. So the next day I come home, you know, to my apartment, and I'm going to read the Bible tonight, and I start to just back to check the Bible and I fall asleep. So this happened like 34 times. And then one night I'm out with the guys and I come home at like 1 o'clock in the morning and I come in my room and I had a few beers probably more than I should and I see a Bible on the table and I'm like I got to read that. I got to read it right now.

Speaker 3: 4:15

Wow, so I pull it open and it's like you know you're looking at it and you can't focus on it and I just started thinking what am I doing? What am I doing with a burning desire for God but chasing all the things in the world? So I guess there's where the Lord got my attention and my love for the Word of God started blossoming into something that's out of jealousy. It was breaking the ground and it was going somewhere, a long path from there, so I'll stop right there, but that's where it kind of started.

Speaker 2: 4:53

Where did you grow up? Again? I grew up in Mapleville, carolina. Okay, this happened in Raleigh, really. Yeah, it sure did, wow.

Speaker 3: 5:03

It's amazing I'm standing here talking about it in raleigh because I was living in an apartment complex and uh in raleigh when that happened, working for a large electrical company out of durham, I moved up with like 100 bucks in my pocket and decided I was going to go make my own way.

Speaker 2: 5:22

Wow, were you, were you? You have siblings, and were they? Were they also kind of? Did you kind of live like a rebellious? I guess it sounds like you were somewhat rebellious before 21. Were they also kind of wanting to pave their own trail, or my older sister.

Speaker 1: 5:47

Yes, she had big dreams and wanted to do her own thing. Yeah, I had an adventurous spirit, work hard.

Speaker 3: 5:58

I wanted to play hard, as they would say, but I mean I was stuck between the older and younger sisters, so I wouldn't say I was out there, I would just say just a rebellious young boy, like most young boys are yeah, what was so, after having that kind of epiphany, what was, what was that journey?

Speaker 2: 6:24

like going to church, like getting connected with a body of believers and, um, getting discipled by people.

Speaker 3: 6:33

Yeah, I actually think I went further away from where I was supposed to go closer during that time frame, moved back from raleigh to the coast of North Carolina, started hanging out with a new group of friends, getting to know people again, reacquainted with people I've moved away from, and I would say the next three years were pretty much a blur Just work and hanging out.

Speaker 2: 7:02

Hmm, of just work and hanging out. Hmm, did you meet your wife Jenny? When did y'all meet? I met her when I was 24 years old about to turn 25. Was there some sort of like did you find yourself kind of coming back to another place of like what am I doing again? Oh, yeah, definitely. You know I was doing electrical work so I loved that and it really felt like I had my work figured out.

Speaker 3: 7:43

It's just a matter of what's next. I thought I'd been married by 22 or 23, because I was really looking for that but never finding the right person. I'd just come to a place, like I said, in that little three-year gap of yeah, what am I doing? I'm supposed to be chasing the board and I'm chasing everything else. Still, it's almost like when I decided I was going to get on track, that something pushed me further or drew me further away and I'm not a prodigal, but it would be a similar story probably getting caught up in all kinds of stuff and circling back around to where the comfort of the Father's house was. I won't say I really found out until I met Jim. I've been praying to the Lord to just give me somebody that was family-oriented, come from a big family, and that we had similar values and that we didn't have one here Did you keep the hunger for reading the Word in that time, or was that like a little season there?

Speaker 3: 9:05

I would say that my desire to read the word in that between the time that I had that fire for it and until I was about 24, 25, really got dulled by not being obedient to chase the Lord and still staying tangled in worldly things Mm-hmm, but you were praying, so you always prayed, even as a kid.

Speaker 2: 9:32

Was it? It's fascinating to me, was it like? Did you mean the prayers, or that's so interesting?

Speaker 3: 9:45

I was trying to make deals with the Lord. Just part of my character, I was trying to make a deal. I really wanted to find a campaign. That was something that was, I don't know when you were growing up on a farm. I don't know if it's just my lifestyle or what other people think, but you look forward to being married, you look forward to having a family. You look forward to having those those things when you grow up.

Speaker 1: 10:16

Age and I've been around family all my life, so it was something that was a great thing prayer is one of those things that's like I think there's more people that will say they pray than there are. Christians and of course other religions pray, but what I'm saying pray to what they say is God. That would kind of identify as non-practicing Christians. So, like Christians, maybe I don't know in the US less than half, but the amount of people that pray is like way more than half. I saw a survey at some point but it's just interesting that prayer seems to be something that is not scary, I guess for people or something. I'm not sure if some of my prayers were quite selfish, but some of them I really can remember even now I can feel the sensation.

Speaker 3: 11:13

I remember praying to the Lord and having a strong desire in my heart for whatever I was praying for, which, at the time, was somewhat so how did you meet Jenny Actually? Two buddies. I hung out with good friends of mine. We decided to throw a party. Yeah, we decided to throw a party and we knew everybody in the area, so we threw a party in what they call a jigger.

Speaker 2: 11:59

Sounds funny to me now because I was so far removed, that's actually how I met her.

Speaker 3: 12:19

Yeah, so far removed, and was that the first time y'all met? I would say no, we had run into each other when we were younger where I lived was only about say that we had okay, and a friend of mine that I went to school with invited me to church and I went to church with him. We didn't know each other at the time.

Speaker 2: 12:39

But I'm looking back. I'm okay fan of her there. I remember seeing her and her brothers. Okay, I remember I started following the Lord but I was still kind of in that rocky place because I also really liked to party. I just was always extroverted and loved hanging out. But I remember I was attending a life group in Waco at Antioch, but still like struggling to like party. Well, one of the people that came to my life group ended up coming to one of those parties and I always thought it was so awkward when it's like hey, that's interesting, you're, you're at this party. Yeah, I'm at this party too. I'm throwing this party.

Speaker 1: 13:24

That's weird, oh I have been there, I have. I told this in the podcast before. I was at this party in high school, or we were drinking beers and it's talking to this dude and we're both. We just start talking about jesus and we're like, oh man, jesus is the best. Yeah, I love jesus. I'm just following him now and he his mom owned the christian bookstore in town. That's hilarious and we were just like all right well, it's good to meet you.

Speaker 1: 13:57

We just didn't like it didn't change anything. But it is funny looking back, like how we were still in process.

Speaker 2: 14:05

Yeah yeah, what was, what was that process for you? Was that after you met jenny and like, how did y'all's lives, like how did pursuing the lord, like what did y'all were y'all more cultural christians when you first got married or did y'all like y'all meeting actually help you? Did the lord use that to like have you guys draw closer to him? How did that? How did that happen? I would say that she was definitely part of his plan to draw me where I needed to be.

Speaker 3: 14:49

We were, you know, culturally cultural christians is a good way to put it. I was not going to church on a regular basis, but she started going to church on a regular basis. So she kind of was the one who led us to the place where there was more consistency in church attendance. And that's really where things kind of got simpler for me to actually chase the Lord. Once we started going to church, of course, the draw of Him was way more enticing than the things we were already involved in. So it started to fade away the attraction and the desire that I had to read the Word. Actually it come back like that.

Speaker 3: 15:36

I mean I started reading it and I couldn't understand.

Speaker 3: 15:38

I had to read it all the time and I had to read all the way through to the point where, within a year and I attributed this to her being determined to go to church, determined to get out of where we were at, into something better, because she was the driving force behind that. But once I got in there, I felt like the Lord just said Okay, now I'm going to give you eyes to see and ears to hear and the ability to understand. So I just started reading the Word and before long I felt like the Lord was calling me into His ministry. Read the word and before long I felt like the Lord was calling me into his ministry, to which point I told my wife that she was not all that pleased about. But another story there. Another story but that's where I become real close with the pastor of the church ended up studying and becoming one of the Sunday school teachers for youth and eventually migrated through all the programs all the way up to adult Sunday school teacher and even speaking a little bit at the church.

Speaker 2: 16:50

Wow, and living from there, which that was. It was not like a quick period, it was. We went there for nine or ten years.

Speaker 3: 17:01

But from there I went to pastor in the church and getting ordained as a pastor or a minister but like they say in the country, an elder but you were functioning as like what we would call a head pastor.

Speaker 1: 17:20

That is a weird way to put it when you're dealing with the elders in the prima baptist church.

Speaker 3: 17:27

So out there they have more than one pastor at the church. I'll say there's a senior elder I'm gonna have to be my uncle and I had to go through a one-year process of preaching at all the different churches in our communities and the people would agree to whether they sensed the calling of the Lord on that person.

Speaker 2: 17:51

Wow.

Speaker 3: 17:53

So it's not just an ordination because you got some schooling. It was an ordination by the people of God, recognizing that you were called by God and delivering the message of God.

Speaker 1: 18:05

Wow.

Speaker 2: 18:07

And what age was this? How old were you? I had no idea. I never knew this about you 2012.

Speaker 3: 18:17

2012. Wow, I would say. That was when I became ordained. I was in that process a little bit after I got married. We got married in 2000. And that was the journey there.

Speaker 1: 18:37

Were you still doing electrical work while you were a pastor?

Speaker 3: 18:42

Yeah, I was in a full-time job, preparing sermons during the night for all the women and speaking in some games and sometimes other nights.

Speaker 2: 18:53

Wow, that's a lot.

Speaker 1: 18:57

You miss it. I know you preach occasionally, but yes, I miss it.

Speaker 3: 19:07

Yes, I feel like the Lord's got something for me to deliver that he wants us to hear, which is kind of always my predecessor of speaking. Lord, these are your people. What do they want to hear? What do they want to hear? What do they need to hear and what are you trying?

Speaker 2: 19:21

to say and what process was it like through that church, because now y'all don't go to that church? Was the Lord leading you to go somewhere else?

Speaker 3: 19:36

was there kind of a falling out or although it's a family church that my great-dad started pretty much build. It had that church built, was paid for by the time it was built and he wanted a place for people as they were coming that way to have a place to stop and worship the Lord. So from there we had a lot of community and family involved. So when I left there I actually was moving here and it was probably there's no, probably, but it was one of the most grueling decisions I feel like I had to make Because I knew I was doing what the Lord wanted me to do going or coming here Because Jenny and I prayed about it. It didn't make any sense. So I knew I had to be the Lord because it wasn't my decision. But with my dad being a deacon and me being the younger generation coming up as a minister in the church and everyone else in their 70s plus, there was a lot of weight put on my shoulders to carry the church from there.

Speaker 2: 20:59

In a way, did you feel like you were letting them down? Yes, I sure did.

Speaker 3: 21:05

To the point, where I was starting to have physical ailments because of everything. It was so stressful.

Speaker 1: 21:11

Wow, but you knew you were called to come to Raleigh.

Speaker 3: 21:16

Well, let me go back to something. My grandfather told me Wow, but you knew you were called to come to Raleigh. It didn't matter what the name of the sign said, it mattered whether I was following the Lord and doing what he was asking me to do. So I spent 10 years almost in a Pentecostal church Because of that, to where my granddad from a preemptive Baptist church came and visited me in church and had church with me, which I thought was pretty awesome.

Speaker 3: 21:54

That led me to having a strong confidence when I felt like I was called into the ministry, to step into that and take the ministry role at our church, at our family church. It also gave me the confidence to know that when the Lord told me something, I understood it to follow that. So when Jenny and I prayed about moving to Raleigh and we both got the same answer but we prayed in separate rooms there was no doubt where I was supposed to go and what I was supposed to do. What I didn't count on was that heavy weight of disappointment and figuring out how to navigate those emotions and feelings and seeing the disappointment in my family's face, especially in my dad's face, and the other members of the church who were in considerable disbelief that I was just one way. But again it wasn't one way. I was stepping out in faith.

Speaker 1: 22:59

When was the Pentecostal years that you went to that church 2000,?

Speaker 3: 23:05

2001 to 2009.

Speaker 1: 23:11

So that was like when you got married to Jenny and started going to there.

Speaker 3: 23:16

She grew up in the church of God and that's where she felt comfortable out and that's where we ended up for a good portion of our early marriage.

Speaker 1: 23:30

That church. I don't know much about the primitive Baptist church, but I would imagine growing up there and then going to Pentecostal church. I don't know much about the primitive Baptist church, but I would imagine growing up there and then going to Pentecostal church. There was some emphasis on like spiritual gifts and all that, that kind of got I mean that would be accurate.

Speaker 1: 24:14

I've been there, man. I started going to this church when I was in seventh grade. That was a United Church of Christ, which a lot of people around here in North Carolina don't even know what that is, but very high church choir robes, hymns, pastor wears the garb and all the stuff. I was an accolade, which means I wore a. I wore red robe and lit candles and stuff like that at the on the altar. And I remember when my buddy invited me to his Pentecostal church and they had me in the youth group, they're like brought me up front and everybody like laid hands on me and spoken tongues and I was like what is this?

Speaker 1: 24:54

place. I was like what is this place? I was like these people are crazy. Of course, now I realize that I was not fully aware of what a lot of other people, how they practiced and the gifts of the spirit and all that stuff, but that was a shocking moment. I'm sure it was for you as well. Yeah, very shocking, ross. I'd like to be tested for me, open up.

Speaker 3: 25:30

I don't agree with everybody. I'm skeptical of a lot of things, but I also know I should remain open. At that time, when I was there, I wanted the Lord to show me something. I didn't want to hear what the preacher had to say and take that as the written word. I wanted to read the written word and I wanted the Holy Spirit to teach me, like the Bible says.

Speaker 3: 25:56

So my devotion and my burning fire for the word was because I wanted to know what the Bible meant. I wanted to understand it beyond a sermon. I wanted to know what it said without having to open it up and try to read it three or four times. So I prayed for that and I read the Bible a lot. I read different versions of the Bible. I even read the Quran. I read every kind of book I could get my hands on that would help me understand the Bible better. On the Pentecostal side they have their favorite authors and there's a lot of faith books and a lot of talking about the spirits or the gifts of the spirits. Folks in well, maybe a couple more than they do the rest of them, kind of giving an imbalance there.

Speaker 3: 26:51

So I don't really understand. Or if they're speaking in tongues, well, what's the Lord say about that? Well, or if they're speaking in tongues, well, what's the Lord say about that? Well, if they're going to fall out, then I want to know what the Bible says about that. So my, I guess I was really triggered by the way they were acting and speaking and talking and I wanted to know how, why, what, where and all of that. So I went into really a five or six year reading the Bible so heavily and I don't even like to read, but I couldn't get enough of that book. So God gave me an understanding of the Word of God in those years and he's built upon that. I felt like he was saying okay.

Speaker 2: 27:39

I'm going to give you something. You are asking for it. I'm going to give it to you. So I'm not a good listener, but I do understand what he's written in his word. It's so cool that there was like a hunger there and that you were open, because I think a lot, of a lot of my friends that have a very traditional baptist background they're just not open at all to that. You know, it's interesting that they're. It almost seems like the lord gave you the supernatural hunger for wanting to experience him, even though you weren't sure how. You mentally agreed with it.

Speaker 3: 28:20

Yeah, I was definitely more anxious, and in that time was when I started really having visions and seeing the Lord's face, starting to understand his leading and guiding, because you know, when you first hear the Lord, you go. Well, what is that? What does the Lord sound like, what does he look like, what does he act like? So I started having dreams, visions. That's when I found out, shortly before my grandpa passed away, that he had visions.

Speaker 2: 28:56

Wow.

Speaker 3: 28:58

So I actually got to stay with him some of the last years. I would go and stay out there sometimes with him at night. He needed someone to stay with him. We would talk about those things. I was just fascinated by him having visions and dreams and having an understanding of the Bible that was beyond schooling. So I think that kind of kept the passion alive too, even though it was towards the end of the 10-year stint where I was really heavy on my reading.

Speaker 3: 29:39

Let me make something else clear During those years of reading and being on fire or reading the Word of God, there was a whole lot of other stuff that the Lord was kind of like a sponge just squeezing the dirty water out of me so I could soak in all that was good on what that heat was. So there was all kinds of struggles, you know marital struggles, trying to figure out those things, personal struggles, trying to figure out who I am in Christ. I sound a lot more confident probably now about it, but there was a lot of ups and downs and crazy stuff that happened. I was getting visions, I was getting a better understanding of the word, but at the same time that was flushing out all of the things that didn't belong. While it was filling me up with all the things that didn't belong, I don't know how far I'm supposed to go with that.

Speaker 2: 30:34

You can go as far as you want. Was there a certain moment where you started getting victory in some of those things, or was it like, were there certain things that the Lord delivered you from immediately, like immediately, or was it more of just kind of a slowly the Lord's chiseling away to getting some of this out? It was a slow chiseling process because I feel like the Lord was slowly calling me and making me what he wanted me to be.

Speaker 3: 31:16

So there was a lot of ugly stuff in there. I didn't get freedom from some of the things until I really not only repented of them to the Lord, but confessed them to the Lord. There were some things that I needed to say to her in order for us to be able to move past some things that were really stumbling blocks for me. As Steve Chilton once put it a wall.

Speaker 2: 31:52

I mean I was bumping into a wall and kept running into it and I didn't have enough momentum to bust through the calls.

Speaker 3: 32:00

The momentum I needed was repentance and obedience and humbleness.

Speaker 2: 32:08

And until those, were at the driving force. I couldn't bust through that wall. Was the wall like? Was it relationship with your wife or was it relationship with God, or was it kind of all-encompassing it?

Speaker 3: 32:23

was closer and closer to me and leading me where I needed to be, but I was so hard-headed about some things I thought that I'm doing these things, but there were some other tendencies that were hidden, really, and until they were brought out into the light, I wanted to move past them. And let me say that Jeannie does not know I'm here right now, so she is. We've been married for 25 years and I will say we would been married for 25 years and I will say we would go off to marriage retreats and everybody would always ask us are you all right? And we were all right, but we were working on our marriage. But at one of those events I was sitting at a fire and I was looking at the fire and she came up and she sat behind beside me and it's like I felt the Lord sit beside me.

Speaker 2: 33:24

He was on one side and she was on the other, and I heard a whisper in my ears it's time to tell her, wow.

Speaker 3: 33:34

I just started bawling and she was was like what is wrong? She comes over there, she's comforting me, she's hugging on me and I was like I gotta do something. I was like I gotta find out what's going on with you and it just crushed her, crushed her, crushed her. And she had a cause. Although I thought I was looking at a picture, it was more I was. I just broke her trust, I would say seeing her in tears was like a knife just going in your gut and you just can't do nothing about it. But also in telling her she's a strong woman, because she did not like it. But she responded with grace and love and scripture and I'm making this sound a whole lot better than it was.

Speaker 2: 34:44

She was so good.

Speaker 3: 34:46

I think I already repented of the Lord, but I hadn't told her and repented to her, and that was one of the walls I was at. It was something that I didn't see that needed to be done. It was prohibiting our marriage from growing our intimacy, from going deeper in the Lord together, and it was really hindering our family from growing closer to.

Speaker 1: 35:15

God and it was my fault. Wow. Would you recommend because this is a common struggle, you know, among men, or it's not uncommon, I should say, would you recommend a married man who's struggling with that deal with it the same way, like, is there a right time to bring everything into the light or do you wait on that? Do you just go ahead and rip the band-aid off? The right time to confess that and rip the bandaid off was yesterday Gotcha.

Speaker 3: 35:59

Because what I was holding on to and not wanting to do was really the one thing that was going to catapult me to the next level. It was the one thing that the Lord was saying hey, you're dragging around this lake and it's time to let go of it. I wish I had done this sooner, but that night sitting in front of that fire I had to, because he told me I had to it was like there was no other option. I had to sit in there. It was not taking another day not going, another night, not another sunrise without me having to tell her exactly what was going on. So she's going to be my helpmate. How could she help me if I'm hiding?

Speaker 2: 36:48

something from her. How could she help me if I'm being this boring when I see you at that time? Was that an ongoing struggle, like at the beginning? Was that something that was like you kind of fell into after being married? Or was it something that was just part of your like history? That was a struggle, or was it?

Speaker 3: 37:17

yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 37:23

I really threw out of control. What was some revelation after you confessing that to Jenny? What was some revelation that the Lord shared about his own heart with you?

Speaker 3: 37:40

I would say, from that point, the revelation that I got, which I kind of hard to share about, was you think you're hiding something and we know that everything's going to come into the light. But when you walk it forward into the light, I want to say there's some kind of honor in that and I don't know how to put it in the right words. It's almost like you're saying here Lord, look at my dirt. But I feel like at that time he was saying, hey, you've got to tell her.

Speaker 3: 38:17

And he was pushing me with his hand gently behind the light, saying okay, son it's time more than me just saying, okay, I'm gonna do this out of my own strength. So the revelation is you feel the the hand of the father on you and you hear that voice it's time there's no discussing it any further. There's no holding it all, holding off on it any further.

Speaker 2: 38:41

You've got to do it. Did you feel like the weight had been lifted when you shared that?

Speaker 3: 38:48

Yes, it felt like. It felt like I'd been suffocating when I said it. I'm so used to the suffocation, it's normalocating, wow.

Speaker 2: 38:59

but when I got that off my chest it was, it was like a debris, wow.

Speaker 3: 39:05

But we're talking about me and we're not talking about the impact to my spouse, which didn't push a suffocation on her, because now she's got to deal with all the all that information and how to process that not a very proud moment for myself.

Speaker 1: 39:28

I'll say that. Did the power to resist, did you have more strength to resist temptation after the confession? I've noticed that in my own Power to resist. Did you have more strength to resist temptation after the confession? I've noticed that in my own accountability and stuff like that. In college I had an accountability group where we would discuss sexual temptation and pornography and just all the stuff that young men in college are often dealing with, and when we were forcing ourselves to talk about and kind of come with our weekly record of what we did and didn't do, it got.

Speaker 1: 40:09

It was like it was like going to the gym. It's like all of a sudden, I have this strength now to resist. I'm stronger, spiritually stronger, just by confessing sin issues right to guys in my life and I think that there is honor in that and there's. The honor is like it's in the humility of like recognizing. I can't deal with this on my own. I think when you hide something where I, you know which we all do, like you're saying, oh, I got this, I can, I'll eventually figure it out, Right, yeah.

Speaker 3: 41:18

Yeah, I'll figure it out. Yeah, yeah, I'll figure it out. Probably not a full recovery without her allowing that. She was a part of the healing process. She's been a rock star in multiple aspects of my life. I had my own company, which failed, and she was a rock star.

Speaker 2: 41:40

What kind of advice would you give Christian men who feel too petrified to share with their spouse why God said you need a spouse. What happened? I think that's a good word. I don't understand. She's got your back. She's there through everything.

Speaker 3: 42:16

She sees you in the ugly spots and the good spots and you want her to be your support. But when you don't, when you withhold, you're breaking the intent of the covenant with your spouse.

Speaker 2: 42:35

What would I think that's a powerful word Like. Down that same vein, what would you say when men say, well, I don't want to hurt my wife, hmm, hmm the truth sets you free, not only individually but if you're one flesh with your spouse, if you're covering something up, you're also covering something up.

Speaker 3: 43:06

If you're a representative of her, you're supposed to be washing her with the word and you're supposed to be presenting her to Christ, clean and washing the word. If you're hiding something, you're not doing that You're deceiving yourself, you're deceiving her.

Speaker 1: 43:23

And you think you're getting away with it. Michael, there's a story I think you told me I can't remember the details of it when you had like a bunch of tools stolen.

Speaker 2: 43:40

I do not know this story, so yeah, starting out.

Speaker 3: 43:51

Young man First, started out in a biomedical company, Broke out on my own, Get a car to go install a generator and an ATS in a very, very ritzy neighborhood on the coast. So I get there and I've got my truck and I've got a trailer full of tools and so I'm going to move from up there to the first trailer. So I'm performing the job and about to wrap it up, need maybe another couple hours, two, four hours. So I run over to the hunting depot, I run inside real quick and grab this one piece so I can finish this job. It was probably a dollar thirty-nine or something like that.

Speaker 3: 44:48

So I go inside, get it, hop back in the truck I mean was in and out, quit, Hop back in my truck, drive to the guy's house and you know he's the mean man in the driveway water view, everything. So I'm going up there. I'm like, okay, I'm fixing to finish this job. I'm getting a good customer, a great neighborhood. This is going to really work out great. So I go to open my trailer door and I realized the lock wasn't on it. Oh, silly me. Got to put the lock on there, Open the door, Zero tools in my trailer when I went into.

Speaker 2: 45:25

Home Depot. Oh my gosh. I opened my trailer and it gave me out every single tool in the trailer. I mean, it was kind of like walking in and there was a few plastic wrappers in the trailer and some saw blades and pretty much everything. Oh my gosh, yeah, really embarrassing.

Speaker 3: 45:47

Thinking how am I going to finish this job? I told this guy I'd be done today. So I have to go and knock on the door. And of course I'm going to run over there and knock on the door. And of course I'm running over there knocking on the door. I'm like sir, I'm not going to be able to fix your job. He knows I'm almost done. So he's saying well, what's the problem? I went down to the depot and somebody stole all my tools. Take him out to the trailer, show him the trailer and the tools.

Speaker 3: 46:16

So I get in my truck and I'm just thinking, wow, what in the world am I going to do? I mean, you're talking about thousands of dollars worth of tools. I don't have a drill, I don't have anything. So I'm looking down and this is the age of flip phones, just so you know I'm looking at my phone trying to figure out what I'm going to do, and here I am peck on the window. So I got a peck on the window, I roll it down, he hands me a check and I'm just in disbelief because it's not a small check. So he gives me a check and he says I said, sir, I can take that, I can take that check. He's like well, I don't know why not, the Lord told me to give it to you. No, sure enough and I was not a very good Christian at that time, but that's exactly what he told me.

Speaker 3: 47:14

He said you have to take it. The Lord told me to give it to you. So of course, I thanked him and everything. I remember rolling up a window and I backed out of this driveway and pulled around the corner and called my dad. I was like hey, dad, so much for all the toys. He's like well, what are you going to do? I was like well, this guy just gave me a check. He told me that the Lord told me to give it to him. What should I do? Should I tie it to the church? He's like no, that is hilarious.

Speaker 3: 47:57

Wow.

Speaker 1: 48:30

Yeah. Hypocrisy thing because there was so much dishonesty and, yeah, hypocrisy. Is that enough to go buy more tools?

Speaker 3: 48:35

I went and bought more tools. I went and bought everything that that chick would buy and I went back and finished his job and I used those tools for them. I had some of them when I closed shop.

Speaker 1: 48:47

So you are now in Raleigh, you're in ministry, you're a youth pastor with your wife, jenny. So as you look back at that calling to come to Raleigh from Maple Hill and you disappointed some people in the process what do you think the Lord has done in you? How would you summarize what's transpired so far with that obedience?

Speaker 2: 49:21

I love that question.

Speaker 3: 49:27

I have hindsight now, so that's always my better thing.

Speaker 1: 49:30

Right.

Speaker 3: 49:30

Than looking forward. I will say, since Gene and I have come up here and stepped out and answered through that prayer of faith, that he has allowed us to be restored in ways that we didn't even know we were frail and broken.

Speaker 2: 49:50

I'll do a little cheer for the arts in the ministry. Restore the foundations. It's a. I'll do a little punch here for the RTM ministry Restore the foundations.

Speaker 1: 49:59

It's a fantastic ministry, second, that Third, that actually.

Speaker 3: 50:05

That was monumental and some serious healing. And I was in a vision and I was a couple. I have to say that I denied the invitation to come up here first because my boss asked me to start all this over again and I said no. He asked me twice and I said no, and then I went home and said hey, jenny, I think that the Lord's trying to tell us something. And when we prayed about it we both felt like we needed to go. So when we got here, she said I think we should try this church called Antioch. And I scaled through their beliefs and everything and said they don't even wash feet. How do we get to a church that doesn't break free from the in-house abuse?

Speaker 1: 50:56

She's like well, I don't know if were churches that washed feet.

Speaker 2: 51:08

That's amazing. Wow, no way, I've never heard that. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 51:16

Same. That's wild. What are y'all doing down in Maple Hill, washing everybody's feet?

Speaker 3: 51:22

Dude, I like that.

Speaker 1: 51:24

Yeah, it's very biblical. I remember I was there that week.

Speaker 2: 51:30

I missed that Sunday, unfortunately. Well, I didn't want to miss Chris. I wish I was there.

Speaker 1: 51:39

I'm not judging you, ryan, if you're convicted that might be the Holy Spirit.

Speaker 3: 51:46

Ryan, I had to give some context to that because, as I look back, every place that's monumental in my life before I had a hardship to go through, my wife was always with me. The Lord was always leading us. Where I was weak, she was strong, and vice versa. So we pray about it, we say we're moving, we get through. It took me over a year to get through that emotional rollercoaster of my own church and the place where we grew up and where she grew up, and so I don't want to discount that because that was part of God's plan to really build up our confidence of what he can do in our lives. Because since then, like I said, we've had significant healing individually.

Speaker 3: 52:46

She was a teacher for 15, 16 years and when we got here she felt like the Lord was leaving her something different. She ended up volunteering at a pregnancy center and I want to tear her whole story so that she can do one of these plugs. But she ended up on the front lines fighting the enemy face to face in a role, maybe in a different episode. The Lord pulled me away from one place but gave me growth in another. We grew as a married couple in our dependence on one another, our dependence on one another, our dependence on God, establishing more solid foundational principles for the next generation of our family and church. I feel like I'm going somewhere with this of this, but God has really taken us from a place of complacency to a place of being an active part of the body of Christ on the front lines, in every aspect that is possible for us.

Speaker 1: 54:11

It seems like maybe it would have been easy to just stay. It would have been a to just stay right finances are more secure there and having any debt.

Speaker 3: 54:24

We both had the jobs, great community, but we were just complacent in our spiritual life from the outside that were like everything was perfect. Now, looking back, I can see where we've grown to a dull place. And I was coming here. The Lord was just saying I can do so much more with you guys, if you just let me stretch you just a little bit. He has. He stretched us as a family, he's stretched us individually and he's allowed us to really spiritually mature more in the last seven years than our whole lives up to that point Wow, that's wild.

Speaker 1: 55:12

The choice to follow God is not always the easy choice. Oftentimes it's the hardest path.

Speaker 2: 55:19

I think what's really cool about your story, michael, is that it seems like the Lord kind of an overarching theme is like the Lord allowing you guys to create your own legacy. Not that you wouldn't have done that back there, but, like you said, you felt pressure to not let your family down and it was easier and it was easier, but it's really cool how the Lord is giving you guys like. The Lord led you guys out here so that y'all could create something on your own, that you didn't have to be under someone else's legacy.

Speaker 3: 56:11

Yeah we felt like there was a lot of obligation back home. Not that it was. It's not bad to have obligations. Yeah, we felt like there was a lot of obligation back home, Not that it was.

Speaker 2: 56:20

it's not bad to have obligations.

Speaker 3: 56:21

Yeah, sure, it's bad to have obligations that you do because you're just doing them without a reason why. I think we found ourselves there doing the things we were supposed to do and not really having the why, an impactful why, behind them. It's not a kingdom? Why, whereas stepping out and going where the Lord let us here, we've had a why behind everything For the Lord. Why? To bring the glory? Why are you going through this and we still have things going on now? I mean, it's an intense time in our family right now.

Speaker 2: 56:59

So I made him feel obligated to come on here.

Speaker 1: 57:12

Guilt tripped him.

Speaker 2: 57:14

Yeah, well, just spiritual manipulation.

Speaker 1: 57:17

However, you can make the sale the ends justify the means right? I really.

Speaker 3: 57:24

I'm asking at that moment.

Speaker 1: 57:27

I appreciate you asking mine, but it's Lord's doing. Well, if you recall, I think I asked you about a year ago and you said not this year. I felt like things were crazy. Well, if you recall, I think I asked you about a year ago and you said not this year. I felt like things were crazy then because of my dad. There was some sickness. That's right.

Speaker 3: 57:49

You were like in Maple Hill, like every other day or something. My son restored his house so he could move into it. I was trying to get that taken care of. So I was traveling significantly. I was traveling with work significantly on the road a lot, and it just felt like it was forced as opposed to just being in the groove. Now which I haven't told everybody, but my dad was completely clean of the pancreatic cancer but they found the potential was never enough.

Speaker 3: 58:23

He was ready to get back into whatever procedures made for that. John called and said he needed surgery because he busted his knee up and tore everything inside the genitalia.

Speaker 1: 58:38

Goodness gracious.

Speaker 3: 58:54

I'm joking a little bit now, but the Lord really has impactfully entered our lives. When we said yes to Him, when we took a step forward, he has let us know he is going before us, he's behind us, he's on His side, that he's leading us in every direction. We've been given some tears and disappointment with sickness in the family or whatever's going on. I have more peace in my heart right now, in the midst of the chaos of what's going on in my life, than I've ever had.

Speaker 1: 59:29

That's awesome. That's great. On top of that, I get to go every Sunday afternoon and play with a bunch of youth, just have a blast.

Speaker 2: 59:42

that's great.

Speaker 3: 59:42

you are an awesome youth pastor we have a lot of fun and my itch for preaching is taking care of the economy. I do a lesson to a number of audience that and just seeing them grow in the Lord has been awesome.

Speaker 2: 1:00:05

I really feel like they're the ones that are kind of I'm just a part of it.

Speaker 3: 1:00:12

The Lord's doing all that you can't put that group of kids that accomplish the things they're doing, that operating environment. They're in the closeness. They have the desire they have to serve God. No pastor can do that.

Speaker 1: 1:00:27

That is just the Lord. I'm just a part of it, but you're covering it.

Speaker 2: 1:00:34

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:00:35

You're covering it, kind of like with your family breakthrough you talked about early in the middle of the podcast, like if you let, if you, if you have stuff in your life that's uncovering, your family stuff gets messy, but when you have that solid covering, everything can flourish. And so, yeah, you got a lot of helpers and the Holy Spirit's doing a lot and there's a lot of energy. The kids create a lot of energy and excitement but they need that covering that you and Jenny bring and I think that can't be understated. It's been really important in my kids' lives. I got two there and I mean, look, think about youth group like for if y'all were in youth groups, like in more than two, like I don't remember a lot of sunday school I went to, but I remember a lot of my youth group being solid, that that was like pivotal, critical years.

Speaker 1: 1:01:33

You know, you were just washing everybody's feet.

Speaker 3: 1:01:50

I'll say this, shout out to all the country moms who made biscuits for breaking up the bridge.

Speaker 2: 1:02:00

Wow, that is another level For communion like biscuits.

Speaker 1: 1:02:08

Wow, I grew up with real wine too, Even as a kid.

Speaker 3: 1:02:15

kid kids got real wine real wine broken up, biscuits you knew who was going to.

Speaker 2: 1:02:24

That's funny.

Speaker 3: 1:02:27

I'll say that everywhere I've been, the Lord has blessed me, even though I didn't deserve it. But there's pivotal points. He showed up. He showed up big.

Speaker 2: 1:02:39

I don't think I deserved it. I think if he wasn't a loving father full of grace and mercy, I wouldn't be sitting here talking to you guys. What is the Lord challenging you on next Running a business as an employee of his trying to control it? Hmm, michael, thanks for coming on. The show man really appreciate it. Thank you, you, thank you.